An interesting, if rather worrying, little piece of information has emerged from the dark depths of the ARC’s Transport and Urban Development Committee agenda – the meeting on which happened today. And that relates to some discussion that is being undertaken by the Northern Corridor Steering Group (a meeting of various transport organisations that relate to the northern part of Auckland) about whether High Occupancy Vehicles (HOVs) should be allowed on the Northern Busway.
Apparently, as part of the funding justification for the Busway, it was proposed that at some point it would be available for use of High-Occupancy Vehicles: one would imagine that being defined as cars/vans/etc. with three or more occupants. Here’s the little bit from the most recent meeting of this Northern Corridor Steering Group which relates to the issue:
I must say I didn’t know about this whole “once the Victoria Park Tunnel project is completed, we will need to allow HOVs on the busway” issue. I have certainly heard talk about the HOV matter before, but I thought that the idea was rejected because of safety concerns – and also because at peak hours those vehicles would clog up the busway, which is used by a pretty significant number of buses at those times.
And this shows the real problem with the idea – that the very same time when the busway would be in most demand for HOVs it needs all the capacity it can get for use by buses. Now I know that the busway is currently not at capacity – even at peak times – and it may be quite some time until it does reach capacity. So perhaps it wouldn’t be a complete and utter disaster (from a pure capacity perspective) at the moment if HOVs were allowed on the route. The problem is that once they are allowed, it will be damn difficult to then “take the busway back” exclusively for buses once we really are running a number of buses that couldn’t handle sharing the road with HOVs.
I see the busway as effectively being a “railway on rubber tyres”, and its designation as being part of the Rapid Transit Network (RTN) supports that. The whole entire point of the RTN is that you give public transport an exclusive right-of-way that does not have to mingle with general traffic in any sense, nor have to deal with intersections at the like. Most of the RTN consists of the railway system, but the busway is a pretty good ‘cut-price’ alternative to having to construct a railway line under the harbour and up the North Shore (although I imagine we’ll have to do that eventually). If we allow private vehicles on the busway, then in my mind that would no longer be part of the RTN. Vehicles could break down, there could end up being too many of them and therefore the busway would get clogged and put off public transport users – and the whole point of running the busway next to a congested motorway: to get people out of their cars, would effectively be lost.
Let’s hope sanity prevails and the busway remains just that: a busway.
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I posted a similar comment over on Aucklandtrains, if HOVs are allowed onto the busway then in my view it will no longer be a RTN but rather a QTN and basically just a buslane next to the motorway. By all means create a HOV lane on the motorway but it should be one of the general traffic lanes on the motorway rather than compromising the northern busway which has turned out to be a run-away success. I also have no idea how the Victoria Park tunnel even relates to the Busway – aside from the fact that the motorway will be twice as large and hence generating even more traffic in this part of town – how does that mean PT needs to be further compromosed?
Turning one of the lanes on all our motorways into a T2 lane at peak times could potentially have some interesting effects.
It would have an interesting effect. I’d also be interested in what the passenger count per hour along the busway is during the peak compared with one of the general lanes of traffic. If this is really an exercise of maximising capacity then shouldn’t we be targeting what is performing the worse passenger-wise? My guess would be that general traffic lanes carry less than the busway does during peak. Therefore, shouldn’t one of these lanes be turned into a T2….
Isn’t in funny that you start the day with the exhiliration of knowing that Western Line is completed, only to be kicked in the nuts by something like this.
RTC, I have heard that the busway carries around 2 lanes worth of traffic in the peak direction.
James, oh so true! The roller-coaster ride of being a public transport advocate!
The busway is one of the things I like most about living on the North Shore. For example this morning it was going to take approx 20 mins for a car to go from Constellation Drive on ramp to the motorway to Tristram Ave, while the bus takes approx 15 mins to get all the way into town. I agree with the other posters letting HOV’s on the busway will be a big mistake and will only lead to more accidents etc
Wow does it really only take a bus 15 minutes to get from Constellation to the CBD on the busway? That’s mighty impressive.
I had better amend my comment to make it clearer, 15 – 20 mins to fanshawe street depending on traffic on harbour bridge.
It would seem that cars going through the bus stations quite fast would make them reasonably unpleasant places to be.
Also at Sunnynook station the cars would get stuck behind the buses loading and unloading passengers.
I agree with rtc. Why not put the HOV lanes on the motorway system. T2 has a bad name in Wellington because the Mana lanes were an epic failure. This was becuase the system was confusing and residents were turning in and out of their driveways, slowing down the flow of traffic. The lane has to be in a place that will benefit the motorist while maximising the performance of the system. The inside lane of the motorway would have the least amount of interuptions. I’m not sure having an HOV along a busway will provide these benefits if motorists are being held up by Buses stopping.
Also, if one of these vechiles has an accident in the busway, it will have major effects on getting people to work and could cuase major chaos on not only the busway but the Northern Motorway.
Firstly the busway appears to have been a huge success getting more and more passengers using it. Colleagues who use it now say they sometimes have to wait for a few buses to pass just to be able to get on one (perhaps Ritchies need to buy a few more buses). As for the HOV issue, we should not be letting cars, vans or taxis on the busway, it would completely defeat the purpose, also imagine the outcry when someone gets hit by a car flying through a station. The sooner we convert this to a rail line the better.
As for HOV lanes on the rest of the motorway, this is a good idea, when I was driving around western parts of the US last month I came across a few different implementations of HOV lanes which could be used here. In the most basic example a few signs were put up saying the “fast”/inside lane was a HOV land and how many people minimum were allowed per car. They also painted a white diamond in the lane every so often as well. The advantage of this is that outside peak times it reverts back to a normal lane anyone can use.
In LA they take things a step further and make the HOV lane an express lane that is separated by double lines and rumble strips, every few km they would have a merging point where you could get into or out of the lane back into the general traffic lane. This worked quite well except not knowing the road it was hard to work out if if I should get out of if or not as you don’t want to miss your off ramp.
I wonder if we might need some higher capacity buses to run these services in the next couple of years?
Or maybe lack of parking spaces (and poor feeders) may slow growth first.
It’s clear this proposal has nothing to do with improving the PT system and more to do with expanding the motorway system for cars by stealth. The sooner this is converted to rail such that this debate can’t happen the better, but it won’t be soon enough unfortunately, to save the busway from potentially becoming just another clogged motorway lane.
A lot of this is coming from the taxi industry:
http://www.nzherald.co.nz/transit-nz/news/article.cfm?o_id=223&objectid=10490780
But see: http://www.shoreshuttles.co.nz/
Groan, I hope Busway users will create a stink about this…
So HOVs already appear to be allowed on the busway if that shuttle is allowed as the website seems to suggest….
Only a few airport shuttle vans are allowed on it as far as I know. Opening it up to cars with three or more people is a totally different matter.
I don’t know if i should laugh or cry here. Sadly this shows when it comes to public transport, we just don’t get it.
You can just see it can’t you? Gridlock on the busway with angry motorists honking their horns at buses as they stop to pick up passengers, indignant that they are being held up.
Lets just put some numbers around this to see exactly what we are talking about.
359 cars per hour will be allowed on, I assume this means half each way which is 180 cars per hour in the peak direction. This is one car every 20 seconds that will be coming along plus all the buses. Those cars are going to be travelling at speed as they won’t be stopping at stations which means that buses will be delayed having to find a gap to get back on the road because we all know how polite Aucklanders are when it comes to buses.
The next issue comes in the mornings when the busway ends and has to merge with general traffic city bound. 180 cars will be trying to squeeze in which is only going to cause delays and a queue of traffic on the busway. Buses will of course get held up in this which is going to slow down journeys into town. This will make the busway less reliable and less attractive to users.
Of course if the number of cars is 359 in each direction then that is a lot worse, it is 1 car every 10 seconds and the queues where traffic merge will be horrendous
I’m pretty sure 359 per hour means 359 in the peak direction, actually I’m not sure if the road layout can support HOVs in the outbound direction at all. So thats one car every 10 seconds.
That would be an absolute disaster. Although i’m sure the Libertarians out there would think this was fantastic news.
If HOVs are allowed, I will fly to Auckland and sit in front of them.
I find it weird that the NZTA only funded this contigent on HOVs being allowed and yet only funded the Central Connector contigent on HOVs never being allowed on it. I can only assume this was inserted to appease some politician back in the day. I’ve heard mutterings from National that the busway is a white elephant that should also allow cars so I’m not sure they will be standing up for the PT using public in this situation.
You’re right RTC, it is odd. Perhaps the difference is that the Central Connector is a few years later and NZTA were a bit more enlightened by that point?
If that where the case they would drop the call for HOV to be added. What we need is a strong local voice telling NZTA to bugger off and leave the busway as it is. If we had a PT friendly council after November they might have enough of a voice to do that, don’t like the chances though.
I’m interested as to how National quantify that the Busway is a white elephant. Because it’s not congested?
I think because they claimed when they drove past they saw no buses or some rubbish like that.
I think they “did”. I’m not sure if they still do.
I’m all for carpooling, but it should be a function of the motorway. The bus way should one day become rail.
However – how about some sort of middle ground in the interim? Slugging, or a government-led HOVER initiative, or shuttles with special licenses, or t4, or t5 (rather than t3) for a smaller but still useful commuter uptake.
I see everyone’s point above. But I also see redundant capacity. And I wonder, is it possible to utilise that capacity *somehow* without clogging it up?
The simple fact is that if people want better utilisation the busway they need to catch a bus, rather than demanding better ‘utilisation’ by being allowed their car on it.
“is it possible to utilise that capacity *somehow* without clogging it up?”
Yes, more buses of course!
I find it funny how on the motorway they are in a constant battle to get spare capacity (i.e. ‘free flowing traffic’), yet the second the busway has some spare capacity it needs to be filled up with cars to be efficient!
Don’t allow cars on the busway!
It’s like allowing cars to drive on railway lines.
“IF” HOV’s had to be allowed on the busway it should only be between Esmonde SB to the Bridge, so long as buses are not impeded.
Anywhere else would be PT suicide.
It is too dangerous.
http://www.brisbanetimes.com.au/queensland/woman-drove-2km-through-busway-before-death-20100811-11zdu.html
Are Brisbane busway’s single direction only on either side of the motorway?
The whole problem is that the Busway was justified with a BCR that included HOV’s.The section I identify above is the only section that is one way and south of the stations.
This means that it is no longer dangerous because there can be no head on collisions or ped conflicts.
Anywhere north of Esmonde Road would be dangerous and also negate the whole purpose of the busway.
It would move cars off the motorway, improving travel times on the motorway at the expense of the buses.
If the projected benefits have now been obtained without HOV’s then there is no need to even look at the concept ever again.
I like the alternative idea of NZTA replacing a motorway lane with HOV/Freight, rather then tampering with the successful Busway.
But surely Jonathan an actual retrospective cost benefit analysis of the the busway will show it to be positive as it is. Could it be better with cars clogging it? Only if your systems so privilege the value of a car with 2 or 3 people way way above that of a busload…. Wouldn’t put it past MoT and NZTA to try, but really that couldn’t stack up.
The busway is a 2 lane road on one side, and separate from, the SE Freeway.
However there are a number of ramps and these look just like normal intersections if you don’t pay attention and thus you can end up driving on the busway by accident.
Do they have median barriers?
There are no median barriers.
http://www.youtube.com/user/Gazza2?blend=1&ob=5#p/u/0/GD3T06hudzc
Brisbane Ferries, busway and trains….